Tuesday 7 April 2009

Guns! Huh! What are they good for!?

Interesting post by James Kelly along at SCOT goes POP!
James got himself entangled in an American blogger's site in a discussion about gun control.
He reminded me very much of AM2's early posts on the Scotsman, surrounded on all sides by people who refused to accept his argument; yet he stuck to his guns, or indeed lack of them.
There seemed to be a complete dearth of understanding on both sides.
The Americans were completely outraged about British householders being charged by the police after using force on vandals or housebreakers.(And quite rightly so, in my opinion.)
And yet...most of the Americans could not see that if guns are too freely available, then they are more of a danger, not a protection.
We in Scotland at Dunblane, suffered a madman with his legal firearms doing something horrific to our children.
In the US, and recently Germany, it seems to be the children doing the killing...
The current case in Edlington, Yorkshire is a case in point; what if those little nutters had had access to a firearm?
And yes I know I shouldn't have had my finger in the trigger guard...


  1. Conan, how did you know I was going to complain about your gun hold? I've been half following James today too and few of the Americans seem to understand why we don't allow guns4U. I had a quick look through the comments on the US site and it was quite interesting to know many think us Scots are sheep where our rights are concerned.


  2. Oh btw Conan, you feeling any better? Still on the 8 hour a day dog-walking routine?

  3. A wee bit better subrosa, have yet another appointment with a different doc on Thursday.
    So we shall see...

  4. Having owned a few guns in my time I am ambivalent on the issue. I owned guns because I lived in an area where bears would routinely raid my rubbish bin, and I didn't want my kids to be on the menu. But what if you live in an area where the predators are other human beings?

    Many Americans and Canadians argue that banning guns only affects law abiding citizens while the crooks don't care - they're going to get them and use them whether legal or not.

    Toronto in the sixties was a relatively quiet place. There were few murders. Stories like these are now common:

    "As many as 15 young people were involved in a shooting spree that killed a teenage girl and injured six others in a packed downtown Toronto area on the busiest shopping day of the year, police said Tuesday." tinyurl.com/dmrkov

    "On Tuesday, in downtown Toronto, a 23-year-old woman named Georgina Leimonis was shot and killed in a café known as “Just Desserts.” She had been talking with friends when three men, one of whom was armed with a shotgun, entered the café and demanded that customers hand over their wallets and purses. In the course of the robbery, the gun was fired, and Leimonis was severely wounded. She died in hospital a few hours later." tinyurl.com/d2t7tp

    Peoples perceptions of gun crime in Toronto is that it's "Jamaican crime", as most shootings are done by folks of that ethnicity. This is difficult territory for policy makers. Clearly the problem lies in the Jamaican community, but it is not possible to address that fact given the multicultural policies of the Government.

    The reaction to the increasing use of guns is a firearms register which pisses off farmers, hunters, and mountain men who own licensed long guns while the real problem is illegal hand guns, and sawed off shotguns. Obviously a register is of no use in curbing the proliferation of these weapons, but politicians must be seen to be doing something.

    I don't know what the solution is, but I think we'll always have atrocities like Dunblane and Columbine, sad to say.

  5. Guns should only be allowed to shoot torys with..and people who agree with the torys

  6. http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/news/uk/article5889125.ece

  7. I could use a gun right now! and i'd know who too shoot too :-)

  8. JuanKerr.com

    who? name and shame..go on...or are you too 'SCARED' (frit) of being done for incitement to violence muslim style.

    see big brother totalitarianism does work.

  9. sorry conan but here you are with the good ole snp boys..snigger! snigger


  10. Looks like the reunion of the Poontang Recce platoon, My Dong 1967.

  11. There is a place for guns but I think Scotland's got it just about right now. Knives have replaced guns but knives were always around weren't they.

  12. Shouldn't it be "Quis custodiet ipsos custodes"?

  13. Sorry - to clarify, I mean the words on the yellow blob under the flapping beastie.

    Re your AM2 reference (and I'm sure he'll be very touched that you're still thinking about him). The Hootsmon comments pages attract CyberNats like to flies. If you're a Unionist poster, you know you can go there and be guaranteed a good scrap. By definition, a lot of Unionists go elsewhere - Grauniad, Torygraph etc. There are lot of lurkers, however - go back to the day after Glenrothes and you can see a lot of new IDs, either newly registered or decloaking.

    Now as for Septics and guns. It is one of those topics where a lot of them simply inhabit a different planet from us effete Euros. But, it is a much more sparsely-populated country - you don't have to go far in the States to get to places where you think "How long would it take the police to get here?"

    Also, it does still have many more dangerous varmints and critters. A few years back I was involved in an incident in Oregon where a bear had run out in front of a motorbike three or four cars ahead of us. If one of the locals hadn't had the ubiquitous gun-rack in his pickup so that poor injured Baloo could be finished off, things could have been a lot worse.

  14. Blow me you're right sm753! A terrible lapse of memory, must be the drugs...

  15. Rabid animals, we have them and I grab the shotgun. No time to make noise, grab a garden tool. Save the livestock and kids that think they're cute. Rattlesnakes, tools work and I leave them alone, unless they're in my back yard and then they're dead and they are. I'll pay the fine for it and gladly.

    Recently gun shots in this tiny town with no police. I didn't like it as they were coming from within town. I ran upstairs to grab the shotgun, it wasn't where I put it and I was mad as hell. False alarm, it was spring gobbler season and I had forgotten. They were sighting in the rifles.

    I ignore shots in the dark of night. Someone is putting deer on the table and they don't do it, around here, unless it is needed.

    Flatlanders, make your own laws and leave us to make ours. In other words, fuck off, until you get a taste of country life.

  16. Hey postpaleo.
    Over here firearms have to be kept in a double locked steel cabinet with the ammunition kept separately; I have a 19th century cavalry sabre on the wall for, ahem, emergencies...

  17. Posrpaleo:

    What's the difference between flatlanders and mountain men? Flatlanders are like trees - you plant them and they stay put.

  18. Flatlanders are like trees - you plant them and they stay put.I once heard a work colleague described as a 'wheelbarrow'. If you don't push it, it stays where it is.

  19. Flatlanders are a local, and long standing, name for those that are more city/suburb oriented. They come here to visit, buy up the land for their summer get aways, sometimes. More often then not they just come around for the hunting. The deer hunting here is some of the very best any where. They are the ones that hold the power of politics, as they are those with the higher populations. They don't tend to understand what life is really like here. Kind of like tourists that don't think they are.

    We call ourselves a lot of different names, but ridge runner, stump jumper, might be a couple. Generally though it's first and last names. ;p Mountain man? Naw, I wouldn't go that far with it. That generally has an even more independent nature to the name. Although there are more then a few in the area that could do that life style very easily.

    I most certainly have spent time in areas much more rural and got a long fine with the good folk. Although you still are treated as an outsider till they know what you're up. There seem to be some unwritten "rules" that come along with being raised rural. Like being in the woods and meeting someone, you best know what is going on and you best make no mistakes. Make noise and wear red and if you stumble onto something that's a tad illegal, shut your mouth and get the hell out of there.

    I do like electricity and running water. But I can make out just fine without it, we're geared for it. Try that one in the city. That type of thing is much more dependable then it use to be, but it happens enough that we still pay attention to it. I don't like being cold, but I'll be damned if I'll ever move to Florida, what a rat race and I sold the place.